Anyone can return hate for hate, sarcasm for sarcasm, bitterness for bitterness, and ignorance for ignorance. But, if we are in Christ we have been called to a higher walk. We are beloved children of the Almighty God and Christ's Ambassadors. We are held to a higher accountability.
'And Jesus said, "You have heard it said to love your neighbor and hate your enemy, but I tell you to love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you, that you may indeed be the true sons and daughters of your Father in heaven." Matthew 5:43-45 NKJV.
We have been called to be light in a dark world, the reflection of God's love. We are commanded to love the unlovable, forgive, and pray for those that hurt and persecute us; doing good to those who hate us. This is the higher calling. This is real love. This is how we prove that we are true sons and daughters of God.
The by product of living life this way is that, eventually, we live free of all enemies.
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This is a very hard directive for Lesbians and Gay men to take, for our enemies are legion in number, and they begin their persecution of us when we're still tender children . . . they lay siege to us, calling us "faggots," "dykes" and other horrendous names I will not reproduce here out of respect. We are labeled sexual deviants before we're even old enough to know what deviation means, much less anything about sex! Ostracism, threats, beatings and condemnations! Persecution follows many of us all the way through our school years, onto our jobs (civilian and military) and into our neighborhoods. Often, our own family members turn on us viciously. It's inside our church homes where we encounter bigotry at its most cruel and unrepentant. Many of us are driven out of God's house, while many of us stay and suffer, but we all are made to question God's love for us and consider the possibility of an eternity of torment for the "sin" of being who we are. It takes a superhuman effort to find the wherewithal to love and forgive your enemy when there are so many and their transgressions are so heinous! As Christians, we must try, of course . . . but I believe forgiveness isn't something victims can realize independent of their victimizers. In order to truly be forgiven, one must first seek to be forgiven!
ReplyDeleteForgivness as God means it has absolutely nothing to do with anyone but ourselves. Forgiveness is something we do in our own hearts regardless of anyone else's actions. Jesus forgave those who executed Him although they certainly did not ask for it.
ReplyDeleteIn Romans 12, Paul says "If your enemy is hungry, feed him; if he is thirsty, give him something to drink." Paul did not base that on any action from the enemy in question.
We can justify being angry, but that emotion only diminshes the effectiveness of the Holy Spirit in our lives. He gives ALL of us the power and strength to move beyond that anger. We have to make the choice to do so.
But what about those that are unrepentant in their sin? We can say "I forgive" in our hearts and draw closer to the example of Jesus Christ in that way, but how can complete forgiveness occur when it isn't sought?
ReplyDeleteImagine what would happen if you and your wife entered a den of craven crack addicts, all desperate for funds to use in securing another "hit." They've turned your neighborhood into a place that's unsafe for everyone. They've injured, perhaps killed innocent people in their crazed pursuit of drugs. Now, you could walk into the midst of their den, say "I forgive your sins," then turn and attempt to walk out. What would happen? You would likely be attacked, stripped, beaten, and robbed! You could forgive your attackers for those acts, too. You would fulfill a scriptural requirement that way, but how much good have you REALLY done? Even if you escape attack, how much good have you done? Your forgiveness hasn't taught them how to deal with their addiction; your forgiveness hasn't taught them not to victimize others.
Human forgiveness of sin is meaningless in terms of Divine salvation. The sin must be rebuked, and there must be a possibility of repentance! When a human being forgives, it is, in a way, a selfish act. By forgiving his tormentor, the forgiver reaffirms his own relationship to the Christ. He does not affirm or reaffirm his tormentor's relationship to the Christ! The tormentor must do that for himself by repenting his evil deed and seeking forgiveness . . . and it's not human forgiveness that does him any good. It's God's forgiveness, and that's what he must seek. A human being's act of forgiveness does not impart salvation!
We do not bring lambs to the kingdom by reinforcing their destructive behavior. Look again at the words and deeds of the Savior. He allowed himself to be maimed and killed for the purpose of saving us all. Who do WE save by allowing ourselves to be maimed and killed? We try to be like the Christ, but we can never be the Christ. Our self-sacrifice does not have the same significance as His self-sacrifice. We don't make ourselves better Christians simply by suffering abuse in silence and saying and doing nothing to protect ourselves. Didn't the Savior forcefully clear the temple of the Lord when He found it being abused by merchants?
More is required of Christians than turning the other cheek. As we turn the other cheek, we must say, "You've done wrong. I forgive you, but you must STOP doing what you're doing!" And we must say it forcefully! Otherwise, how can our tormentors know the evil of their actions? What's to stop them from going out and tormenting others? Is it Christian to leave your fellow human beings in danger of victimization? Is it Christian to only care about your own salvation and not want to save the other person? Jim, I fear that your approach to our faith, as well as the approach you want Lesbians and Gay men to take, is much, much too passive. I think God led me to your blogsite and is motivating me to tell you so.
((More is required of Christians than turning the other cheek. As we turn the other cheek, we must say, "You've done wrong. I forgive you, but you must STOP doing what you're doing!"))
ReplyDeleteStuffed,
I see that you have a pretty good grasp of forgiveness and repentance. What's become clear, though, is that you refuse to acknowledge that your homosexuality is a sin, which it is.
You see, the very thing you are prescribing up above ("You've done wrong, I forgive you, but you must stop what you're doing") IS EXACTLY what God is saying to you regarding homosexuality.
"I forgive you, but you must stop what you're doing. I have declared it to be a sin, AND YOU MUST STOP!"
I also agree with your other statement: "The sin must be rebuked, and there must be a possibility of repentance." Exactly. God rebukes the sin of homosexuality, and demands your repentance of it. Jesus said "Repent and believe the Gospel", not just "believe the Gospel".
I'm sorry that you were made fun of and brutalised for being a fem, but lots of people got bullied and beat up in school, not just gays. You've got to stop the "martyr" thing.
The key to understanding what I wrote about sin and the need to repent of sin is knowing what sin is in the first place! Sin is what Jesus Christ said it was, not what his Apostles said it was, not what today's crop of evangelists say it is, and definitely not what YOU say it is. Let me clarify it for you: Idolatry. Murder. Adultery. Theft. Dishonesty. Disrespecting elders. Bigotry. Self-righteousness. That's what the Savior said sin is, and guess what? You've violated at least three of those prohibitions! So it's clear that you don't know what sin is. Fortunately, it's not up to human beings to judge sin. It's up to God, and in His wisdom, he gets the definition right every time! You'll save yourself beaucoup stress and frustration by remaining human and not trying to turn yourself into God. Personal ambition should have its limits. BTW, you know NOTHING WHATSOEVER about my experience at school, so don't pretend to! Calling me a "fem," how nice. How Christian! I'd be willing to bet you've used far more insulting terms than that when addressing a person you believed to be Gay. Be careful that you don't commit another sin for ignorance's sake.
ReplyDeleteStuffed Animal,
ReplyDeleteI welcome your patricipation in this forum, but I doubt very seriously the Lord led you here to correct my approach to faith. I hope you focus less on the points you want to make and soak in what others are saying. I pray that you can move past the anger that come across so strongly in your comments. I believe the Bible speaks very clearly about how the Holy Spirit can lead us beyond the pain and suffering others have inflicted upon us and into the fullness of his love. Straight people can get hurt and called names too, just different ones. We ALL need to move beyond that and allow Christ's love to heal us.
That individual Straight people get called names is hardly the point! Straight people are not told by their church that they fall outside the realm of God's love. Straight people are not banned from positions of leadership in the church because of their sexual orientation. Straight people are not condemned from the seat of the Vatican! And if a Straight person is beaten to death and crucified as Andrew Shephard was beaten to death and crucified, you'd best believe it's not for being Straight! You cannot draw a legitimate parallel between heterosexual and homosexual experiences, and I'm absolutely shocked that you would try to!
ReplyDeleteAdvising those oppressed by religious hatemongers to simply turn the other cheek and suffer in silence even while the Christ's message is perverted and turned into a weapon of bigotry . . . that's not what God wants us to do. Deliberate misuse of Christian doctrine not only damages those who are targeted, it damages the doctrine itself!
God's love is not only meant for individual healing, it is meant to heal the world. Christians must share the Divine love they've been given, and to do that, we must actively oppose the kind of sin that mankind visits upon itself: Murder, racism, sexism, heterosexism, greed, hypocrisy, promiscuity leading to venereal disease, and unrepentant pride. Remember the Savior's final commandment: "Love one another as I have loved you." It's not loving to allow your brothers and sisters to destroy themselves, to destroy others, and to destroy the faith that brings salvation to us all.
The presence of anger doesn't nullify a message. The Christ often spoke in anger, and His wisdom was not diminished by it. By no means am I as wise as the Savior, but I possess the common sense His Father gave me. God compels me to speak common sense to you now. You're the one, Jim, who needs to soak in what others are saying, specifically what Gay people are saying about their lives. You claim to be an advocate for LGBT rights, but you can't be an effective advocate if you don't feel the pain of those you advocate for. When you equate the suffering of homosexual and heterosexual people, it's clear that you don't feel it. However, I think both you and your wife are capable of feeling it. Try. Please try! Minister to us, not at us!
((Straight people are not told by their church that they fall outside the realm of God's love.))
ReplyDeleteNobody is saying that gay people fall outside of God's love. God loves you very much....so much that He wants you to repent of this sin and give your heart to Him, allowing Him to change it.
((Straight people are not banned from positions of leadership in the church because of their sexual orientation. Straight people are not condemned from the seat of the Vatican!))
You're being very dramatic, pal (I've noticed you do that a lot). Of course straight people are banned from positions of leadership because of their sexual orientation. If you're caught committing adultery in Christian leadership, you lose your job. If you're caught buggering a kid, you lose your job. Often, if you divorce your wife, you lose your job. There's lots of sins that straight people get disciplined for in the church.
((And if a Straight person is beaten to death and crucified as Andrew Shephard was beaten to death and crucified, you'd best believe it's not for being Straight!))
You really MUST stop the whole 'martyr' thing. It's quite annoying, and once again...too dramatic!
These disgraceful comments by "Anonymous" illustrate what we are fighting against, Jim! Deliberate, repeated and unrepentant twisting of scripture to justify irrational prejudices and hardened bigotry. Feigned ignorance about the nature of sexual orientation, employed to make the bigotry seem more acceptable. Belittling of the atrocities that are visited on Lesbians and Gay men. Insistence that we deny the gift our Lord in Heaven gave to us at birth. Blasphemy, inhumanity, decadence and depravity, all in the name of God.
ReplyDeleteThis person desperately needs the salvation of Jesus Christ. His soul cries out for help from beneath the shroud of intransigence that smothers it. He does harm to others with his "religious" fervor and enjoys doing it. He rapes and defiles the Christ's Holy doctrine and believes he can do so with impunity. It's appalling to witness, here and on other blogsites. He dooms himself without realizing it. Your wife was correct about the need to forgive. If we can find within ourselves the wherewithal to forgive such grievous sins against us, and against God, we must do so. Her words echo those of the Savior: "Love one another as I have loved you."
However, forgiveness must not be confused with approval and encouragement of false prophesy. We must DENOUNCE such behavior! We must endeavor to stop it! When a wayward lamb tries to mislead other lambs, we must intervene! Remember what you read in the 15th chapter of Matthew: (Jesus Christ said) "If one blind person guides another, both will fall into a pit." There is no worse fate! I, for one, am not willing to stand by in mute acquiescence as Satan's false prophets lure vulnerable Lesbians and Gay men into spiritual Purgatory, and I absolutely WILL NOT tolerate the Messiah's name being used to bait their lures.
Stuffed Animal,
ReplyDeletePastor Brenda has been successfully ministering to members of the GLBT community, some of them deeply hurt and wounded, for nearly 20 years using the message of growing beyond that hurt and anger and reaching out to meet the arms of Jesus, which are already reaching out to all of us.
I have received some very positive feedback at this blog from some GLBT individuals who feel the message here is just the type they need. It apparently falls short for you and while I find that disappointing, I can live with it when I weigh that what others tell me.
Jim: It seems to me that the issue here is not one regarding "forgiveness" or comparing hurts between straight and gay people. Rather, the issue that Stuffed Animal is largely focusing on is the error and unGodly attempt to equate the Gospel of grace with the false gospel of exclusion, that takes the form from Anonymous and all too many professing Christians that the latter is a genuine position to take in this or any debate regarding the Christian life. The cold turkey choice to be made is simply this: Are Christians called upon to love and not judge others? Or are we called upon to spew hateful rhetoric and judge others to be outside of God's will because of our interpretation of some Bible verses? That's Stuffed Animal's point, it seems to me, and that point has yet to have been successfully addressed.
ReplyDeleteYou're pathetic, Jerry.
ReplyDeleteThere's nothing like controlling the discussion, huh? You win every time.
Stop trying to protect these lost souls from the truth by deleting my posts. I'm asking relevant questions and trying to engage in discussion.
How would gays feel if I deleted their comments from my website simply because I couldn't stomach their point of view?
You're as bad as Bush.
Anonymous,
ReplyDeleteJerry doesn't have any control of this blog to delete comments. I'm the only one who does and I did not delete any anonymous comment.
Of course, your stand for "truth" would have a lot more kick to it, in my opinion, if you attached your name to it.
You're right, Jerry. My apologies. In my haste I posted to the wrong blog.
ReplyDeleteYou've been fair, I'll give you that.
Ahhhhhh..... I'm still in haste. Got too many things on the go at once.
ReplyDeleteI meant to call you Jim.